Yeah in my experience it’s not rich white guys so much as white guys who live in rural areas, fetishize self-reliance, and not just live in rural areas, but the kind of areas where the government and regulation just kind of isn’t very present. But they tend to have an inability to imagine any other type of area than the one they live in.

Right but again, we don’t have to wonder what the public would think because this has happened multiple times in the last decade and they blame Republicans. This isn’t an unknown, pretending like it is doesn’t help anyone.

Yes there was a right choice, as shown by the polling I literally just linked. You’re supporting the wrong choice.

EDIT: Sorry I didn’t realize you weren’t SatansMaggotyCumFart, but please see the links below.

You don’t have to agree with me because I’m referring to extensive polling conducted after recent shutdowns instead of just pulling hypothetical reactions of out of my ass in order to give cover to Schumer.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_United_States_federal_government_shutdown

https://news.gallup.com/poll/246341/republican-favorability-down-views-democrats-steady.aspx

But Democrats won’t take the blame, we’ve been through this before and that concern almost never plays out. We’re gonna pull our punches because they’re already pretty unpopular and, what, that’s good enough? Are you kidding?

Let’s be honest, if ten years ago taught us anything it’s that the public would probably blame the Republicans for the shutdown. They keep shutting the government down, getting blamed, losing elections as a result, then forgetting and once again shutting the government down. Why the hell should the Democrats save Republicans from the consequences of their own actions?? You know Democrats aren’t going to get any credit for keeping the lights on when they swoop in and vote with the GOP on their asenine budget. Why would you rather take the high road in order to help the Republicans than take the low road for once and let the GOP’s obvious lack of ability to govern bite them in the ass? What kind of a Democrat goes out of their way to save the GOP from itself?

How is giving police departments, now working to enable the authoritarian agenda which WE ALL KNEW THEY WOULD DO, even more money “doing a good job?”

Imagine making an account here and, within 4 days of migrating from reddit, whining about how anyone being even remotely critical of your comments belongs on reddit lol

No. The answer was even more centrists and shitting on progressives even harder. Don’t worry, it’ll definitely work next election, trust me.

Unless they run in the first election as a bridge candidate and then, after being elected, refuse to confirm that he won’t run again for multiple years.

Edit: y’all can rewrite history all you want and insist that the party cannot fail because it can only be failed, but he said what he said: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/10/joe-biden-michigan-rally-kamala-harris-cory-booker

Hold on, last election he refused to say so explicitly, but he repeatedly implied he wouldn’t run for a second term and described himself as a bridge candidate. Then he demanded a second term at the last minute.

Yeah but conservatives don’t care about brown people, remember?

As an American, frankly, there shouldn’t have been much goodwill to begin with. But yeah, it feels pretty bad watching these vermin stab Ukraine in the back. And let’s be honest, these people and the ones that voted for them, my loved ones included, are fucking vermin.

WE REQUIRE MORE MINERALS!

I’m completely on the same page here, to clarify I’m a leftist, but a registered Democrat who votes left in the primaries but down the Democrat line in the general election.

And I totally agree it’s very lofty, that’s why I think more realistic short term goals are to push for things like internal party reforms (e.g., why the feel haven’t we had a real primary since Obama’s first election? Why are the establishment elites trying over and over to recreate the Obama coalition from the top down when the Obama coalition was an organic group that came together despite the establishment Democrats trying to smother it?) and prohibiting or restricting voting stock for non-employee-shareholders.

Anyway, glad we’re actually mostly on the same page. I think a lot of people could get behind things like this, even if they would never back the more lofty ideas I threw out there.

Okay serious answer, no I don’t think democracy is not feasible, I think that democracy is crucial and the inherently oligarchic elements of American democracy, in particular, and to a lesser extent parliamentary democracy, are exploitable in a way that is especially problematic in the context of the post-1980s “shareholder value” type of corporate governance that has become so common. I think that democracy needs to be restructured in a way that is bottom-up on a sub-municipal level. I know that sounds soviet but that’s not what I mean, it should be an open system which is NOT premised on a vanguard party or anything like that. I think that would work in an American context is something more like a Rojavan or Zapatista type of structure, but with higher level protections on a federal level for certain rights, which should include positive rights instead of just negative ones. I also think, unlike democratic confederalist systems currently, there does need to be a separate, yet democratically accountable, judiciary that operates on the basis of stare decisis.

Ultimately, these are very long term and difficult changes, so for the time being I think that building some kind of dual power is a good goal, although to show the viability of this kind of democratic structure rather than, as is usually the goal, trying to somehow smother the state in its entirety. I think site difficult, but actually somewhat feasible, goal should be to enact a third founding, the first being the typical “founding” of America and the second being the reconstruction amendments, which fundamentally changed both the federal structure and almost all federal legal analysis immediately. A third founding, I think, is the only way to do things like enshrine positive rights, abolish the senate or make it proportional, repeal the amendment limiting the size of the House, etc, although making the states themselves bottom-up rather than unitary will require similar, parallel action on the state level.

For the more immediate future, the answer is not, I think, founding some kind of socialist party, but it does require making Democratic Party politics much more democratic and populist. This isn’t that hard, relatively speaking. Parties are pretty easy to structurally change. We can’t win if we keep attacking anybody going against the establishment consensus and accusing them of fictionalism for being leftist and criticizing the DNC’s actions. This thinking is what kills one party states and it will kill the Democratic Party too.

Sorry I’m being such a dick, I just hate seeing such a resurgence of Democratic groupthink at a make or break moment when we reeeeeeeally need to do some internal soul searching and serious self criticism. And most importantly stop trying to uphold norms of decency and reasonableness. It won’t work, we unfortunately have to get in the mud and play dirty back. There’s no valor in losing on the high ground when democracy itself is at stake.

Get elected lol. Look at me I can be a DNC strategist.

“Get elected” lol solid plan bro, let’s run the 2016/2024 play again. Gl.

I’ll admit leftists, quite famously, never seem to have a plan other than infighting, but this is literally a meme about how leftists are undermining a liberal plan for the midterms which DOES NOT EXIST. Maybe liberals should stop throwing around more whataboutism than tankies and actually come up with a fucking plan.

I’m sorry, what’s the liberal plan again??? #resist? Because I haven’t heard anything else. I mean Christ Hochul won’t even remove Adams.